Tuesday, April 12, 2011

Expanding on Susan's Pet's Tease & Deny Post

Before reading my post, please do yourself a favor and read Susan's Pet's post on Tease & Denial. Not only is it a good article, but what I will provide in this post dovetails off of that post.


While I agree with most of that article, I did want to expand on a concept I've been kicking around for while, and it's one he sort of brings up.

In generally stating that unless the wife, after being introduced to the concept of tease and denial actually gets off on it, the wife will generally not participate. Some will not participate at all, while others will engage in it, at best, sporadically. Quoting from Susan's Pet: "One might say that even in a vanilla relationship a woman will do things for her partner simply because she loves him and knows that he needs it. Yes she will do that sometimes, but not often enough."

And that concept is something that has always confused me. And maybe it confuses me because I want to please my partner, but are people really that selfish that they can't derive pleasure from giving their life partner what they want?

I love performing cunnilingus. Why? I would imagine that the fact she really enjoys it is why I enjoy it so much. (Or maybe that's circular thinking? Does she enjoy it that much because I'm good at it and I enjoy doing it?)

Anyway, my point is, I like to make my wife happy. Many people reading this may say "well, that's because you're submissive", but my response then is: "are you telling me that vanilla couples don't want to make each other happy?" That's my source of confusion. How is it that people get married, but know that their significant other loves thing "X", but they don't do it or give "X" to their significant other?!?!?! I don't get it. I truly don't understand that concept.

It has always made me laugh whenever I read articles in the newspaper, see headlines in relationship sites, or Cosmo or something about women bitching that their men are not "romantic". These women clearly love the full blown romance thing, yet the slug they married doesn't ever do anything like that for them. I'm always flabbergasted that the guy has a girl who so desires something, but the guy won't ever do it.

Just seems to me that people who are married should be in love to the point where doing things for your significant other is what makes you happy! Ever since we've been married, I've done things for her that I only did because I knew she liked it.

And even habits that I had that she did not like I changed. That's been a two way street. For whatever reason, dishes in the sink overnight flipped her out. I was generally the type who left them till I felt like doing them. Well, after marriage and I found out how much she hated it, I changed my behavior to wash the dishes as they were used. Conversely, I hated caps left off toothpaste. She never put it back on. She changed her behavior.

Those are kind of silly examples, but as I partially responded to Susan's Pet post on his site, if my wife came to me and said "you know, doing full body massages really really turns me on", well, I'd go out and buy a professional massage table, take a class and go off on her.

This is not absolute. Everyone has "limits." If she came to me and wanted to do scat, or adult baby stuff, I could never get into it. However, the list is rather small.

Regardless, even things that I don't particularly have a desire for, my point is simply that if I knew she had a strong desire for them, I would then have a strong desire for it because I knew how much she liked it.

Please don't take this post to mean that I'm believing that every person should do things for any random person. I can't stand "high maintenance" girls, so it's not like I could love dealing and engaging in those antics. But then again, I would have never married a high maintenance girl.

My point is that if you marry someone, isn't that person you're married to the person you want to make happy? From what I see and read, however, is that I am not the norm. Most people are not like that. Most people are completely unwilling to engage in something that they do not personally like for the benefit of the significant other and, even if they are, they don't particularly end up enjoying it. A guy may realize his wife wants the big romance thing, so he'll do it for her, but he doesn't enjoy doing it. I don't understand that thinking.


rené said...

I'd say the post should better be commented by (dominant) women, but I'd like to give just some thoughts. I agree with you that lovers most likely will have the desire to make the other one happy and therefore do also things that they wouldn't do for themselves, and that they most likely should be able to gain enjoyment out of this doing.

So, just giving a massage or any other "practical" thing shouldn't be a big deal at all. But, I think it's next to impossible to, say, "act dominant" in order to do someone a favour if you simply don't feel that way. A person who is completely vanilla, most likely won't be able to "play" a dominant in a way that a submissive would really be able to enjoy it.

If a person, vanilla to the bone, wanted to do her/his partner a favour and act as a "dom", he/she could more or less easily learn to do the "practical" things (say, using a whip or even saying phrases the other one would like to hear etc.), but he/she would hardly be able to really *understand* what this all means to his/her partner, why it turns him/her on sometimes, and why it doesn't other times. As long as he/she acts out a role/script to do the other one a favour without being able to enjoy his-/herself the power he/she has over his/her partner, it most likely will feel like staged to both of them.

Besides that it's a contradiction in itself: How can a submissive person gain pleasure out of being dominated, if the dominant is acting out this dominance just because he/she has been asked to, please, do so? Who is really the dominant in this setting? How can I see, say, being locked in a chastity device as an act of dominance, when in fact *I* am the one who initiated it and asked my partner to, please, lock me into such a device?

I'd say that the only way to solve the puzzle is to let the "dom to be" do just those things that he/she really enjoys, so that he/she won't be urged to act out a role without enjoying the dominance itself, but may gain real pleasure by it. This maybe won't lead to all the things a submissive may have in his mind in the beginning, but it for sure will feel "real" ... and according to my experiences, it will lead to let those fantasies go without any regret, because now you indeed experience that it is really your *partner* and his/her wishes that prevail ...

D/s isn't about acting out the submissive's fantasies, it's about *submitting*, i. e. bowing to the dominant's wishes. If I'd speak about my own experiences, I'd say that the feeling of not playing dominance and submission on a "favour basis", but *really* submit to my lady and the things *she* finds enjoyable is much more enjoyable to me than letting her act out a role I asked her to act out in order to do me a favour.


Susan's Pet said...

My friend,

In spite of your claiming confusion on the subject, you have a deeper understanding and commitment to a relationship than most men writing FLR blogs. I appreciate your genuine feelings that bleed through your words.

People in love do things for each other just as you and I do. But life is larger than just being in love. That is where commitments will falter. The basics may survive, but when the going gets rough, sexual kinks are first to suffer. Since sex is a basis of most partnerships, no wonder that many dissolve.

I have demonstrated to my wife in deeds and words that I am happy to do anything for her to satisfy her sexually. No matter how many times we satisfy her, she still hesitates to put me to the test next time. She does not see my service to her as something that would satisfy me because it makes her feel good. I believe that this is a sexual kink on my part, and a disbelief of her own importance on her part. When the two meet it is explosively pleasurable for both of us. It takes real effort for her to allow it even though I am ready and willing all the time.

By the way, you have given me an incentive to elaborate on this. Please see my post at http://hersforever.blogspot.com/2011/04/love-and-being-in-love.html.

Anonymous said...

I can relate to your post, and I agree. Although there are always exceptions, I believe it is more often than not the man that wants more, and has that attitude of doing anything to please his wife. Not all men of course, but those that have that desire.

I would do most anything that my wife wanted if I know it pleases her, sexual or not. The reverse is not true. She will do anything I want provided it isn't sexual or kink related.

In a way I just don't understand that, but I believe it is just how men/women are wired differently.

I'm-Hers said...

I can't agree with you more. This is one of those posts that you yourself should never forget. It's becoming like the people you mentioned - that don't do the obvious for the one they love - that end up with marital issues.

Thinking as you noted by doing those things our spouse loves is what love is all about. It's about giving - regardless of whether he or she is domme or sub. Love supersedes all and goes beyond the D/s arrangement of some marriages and relationships.

This is a great post, filled with valuable insights. Thanks for posting.

At all Times said...

AO – great post, with lots of interesting things to think about.

From my own prospective and experience, I would say that it is very important that you enjoy doing something for your partner, either the act itself or because you know that they are enjoying it. I am guessing that most submissive men find this a lot easier than vanilla wives trying to “act” out a domme role in their relationship, especially when a lot of submissive men would like this to be 24/7. While this maybe slightly easier for the wife in the bedroom, a submissive man will almost certainly want to take this outside the bedroom, which I can imagine represents a massive problem for most vanilla wives, regardless of how much their husband would enjoy it.

The only way that this type of relationship is going to work realistically is if the couple can find ways to please and satisfy each others needs and desires, that are both realistic and acceptable to each other. This for me represents the biggest challenge to a couple, where one is seeking female “domination” from the other, and the other one wants to be loved cherished and adored. The two don’t naturally sit together, and for me is a major reason why couples struggle with the concept of a D/s or Wife Led relationship. Clearly there is a middle ground here, but it does take sometime to work out where it is, especially if communication and understanding is difficult. I have always maintain that if a vanilla wife is to become “dominant” in a relationship and to actively want to encourage her husband’s submission, she must first have some good reasons to want to do this.

Sure there is an element of wanting to please their partner, but this, as has already been discussed, will only extend so far. A submissive wants to feel controlled, even dominated, but wants to feel or sense that his wife is doing so because she enjoys or likes to encourage his submission, not just because she is “going through the motions” to please him. He therefore needs to give his wife what she wants and needs, and not just what he thinks she should get from his submissive behaviour. If your wife needs to feel loved, she won’t get that from a slave or servant.